抽刀斷水

不少宗教的神職人員都有獨身的要求，包括神父、修女、和尚、尼姑……

官方文獻對於神父獨身的要求，往往顧左右而言他，明明早期教會是容許的，為何後來卻不容許？真正原因其實很市儈：神父無家室後裔，所累積的財產便免被轉移，可盡歸教會所有。

修女就比較單純，希望退隱清修，或者在重男輕女的社會當中得到尊重，但卻往往淪為神父教士的洩慾工具，這已是不公開的真相。

我們知道愛情這回事，能快樂也能痛苦，和尚、尼姑都是出家人，談戀愛就有機會產生愛別離、怨憎會、求不得苦等等，惹來煩惱影響修行。

庵堂住持被揭與和尚結婚來港，寶蓮寺男女高僧親密同遊夏威夷，佛教界嘩然，其後還是低調處理，不了了之。

「口裡說不，身體卻很誠實」，如果認同人是受造之物，那隨之附送的當然是具備正常功能的性器官，有正常的性功能和性慾。

問題是：為何口裡要說不？

為情所傷、為情所困、為情自殺……由英文老歌 "Wise men say only fools rush in..."，到今天內地網絡潮語「切除戀愛腦」，可見很多人都不懂如何「處理」愛情，也希望能逃避這些「引誘」。

對外宣稱獨身，可以減少這方面的誘惑，假如明知自己獨身而對方仍然靠近，就是對方的錯，自己就只是純粹作為被動一方。

另外比較次要的也是面子問題：是我自己選擇遠離愛情，而不是無人問津。而以前的「自梳女」，可以逃離世俗壓力和規條束縛，但現代已不適用。

時移勢易，以前被傳揚歌頌的「癡心情長劍」，為一生所愛終生不再娶，現已被人恥笑為戇居。壓抑情感，自設藩籬，已是不自然的事。

生命苦短，一句「人生有幾多個十年」，已喚醒不少人要及時做要做的事。愛情，除了痛苦，還可以是甜蜜，「人生的彩筆蘸上悲歡愛恨，描畫世上百千態」，我認為這樣過生命更為完整。

抽刀斷水

神父獨身都係被迫既，咪再包裝啦。

Catholic Doctrinal Evolution

200 AD Immersion of infants who are dying, but considered sinless. (Tertullian V.12)

250 AD North Africa region is first to practice infant baptism and reduced the age of baptism from minors to all newborns. This is opposed by other regions.

257 AD Baptism by sprinkling for adults instead of immersion first used as an exception for those on sick beds, but it caused great dispute.

300 AD Prayers for the dead

320 AD Special dress code of the clergy in worship

325 AD At the general council of Nice, 325, it was proposed indeed, probably by the Western bishop Hosius, to forbid entirely the marriage of priests; but the motion met with strong opposition, and was rejected.

325 AD The date for Easter was set.

379 AD Praying to Mary & Saints. (prayers of Ephraim Syrus)

385 AD In the West, the first prohibition of clerical marriage, which laid claim to universal ecclesiastical authority, proceeded in 385 from the Roman church in the form of a decretal letter of the bishop Siricius to Himerius, bishop of Tarragona in Spain.

389 AD Mariolatry begins with Gregory Nazianzen, who mentions in a eulogy, how Justina had besought the virgin Mary to protect her virginity.

416 AD Infant baptism by immersion commanded of all infants (Council Of Mela, Austin was the principal director)

430 AD Exhalation of Virgin Mary: "Mother of God" first applied by the Council of Ephesus

502 AD Special dress code of the Clergy all the time.

500 AD The "Habit" of Nuns (Black gowns with white tunics)

519 AD Lent

526 AD Extreme Unction

593 AD The Doctrine of Purgatory popularized from the Apocrypha by Gregory the Great

600 AD First use of Latin in worship (Gregory I)

607 AD Boniface III is the first person to take the title of "universal Bishop" by decree of Emperor Phocas.

608 AD Pope Boniface IV. turns the Pantheon in Rome into a temple of Mary ad martyres: the pagan Olympus into a Christian heaven of gods.

670 AD Instrumental music: first organ by Pope Vitalian

709 AD Kissing of Pope Constantine's feet

753 AD Baptism by sprinkling for those on sick beds officially accepted.

787 AD Worship of icons and statue approved (2nd council of Nicea)

787 AD Rome (Latin) and Constantinople (Greek) part ways and begin the drift towards complete split, resulting in two denominations emerging in 1054 AD.

965 AD Baptism of bells instituted by Pope John XIII

850 AD Burning of Holy Candles

995 AD Canonization of dead saints, first by Pope John XV

998 AD Good Friday: fish only and the eating-red meat forbidden

1009 AD Holy water

1022 AD Penance

1054 AD Roman Catholic church breaks away from the Orthodox church

1054 AD Roman Catholics officially embrace instrumental music, Orthodox reject instrumental music down to the present time.

1079 AD Celibacy enforced for priests, bishops, presbyters (Pope Gregory VII)

1090 AD Rosary beads: invented by Peter the Hermit

1095 AD Instrumental music

1190 AD Sale of Indulgences or "tickets to sin" (punishment of sin removed)

1215 AD Transubstantiation by Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council

1215 AD Auricular Confession of sins to priests instituted by Pope Innocent III, (Lateran Council)

1215 AD Mass a Sacrifice of Christ

1217 AD Adoration and Elevation of Host: ie. communion bread (Pope Honrius III)

1230 AD Ringing bells at Mass

1251 AD The Scapular, the brown cloak worn by monks invented by Simon Stock

1268 AD Priestly power of absolution

1311 AD Baptism by sprinkling accepted as the universal standard instead of immersion for all, not just the sick. (Council of Ravenna)

1414 AD Laity no longer offered Lord's cup at communion (Council of Constance)

1439 AD Purgatory a dogma by the Council of Florence (see 593 AD)

1439 AD Doctrine of Seven Sacraments affirmed

1480 AD The Inquisition (of Spain)

1495 AD Papal control of marriage rights

1534 AD Order of Jesuits founded by Loyola

1545 AD Man-made tradition of church made equal to Bible (Council of Trent)

1545 AD Apocryphal books added to Bible (Council of Trent)

1546 AD Justification by human works of merit

1546 AD Mass universally said in Latin (see 600 AD)

1547 AD Confirmation

1560 AD Personal opinions of Pope Pius IV imposed as the official creed

1864 AD Syllabus Errorum [Syllabus of Errors] proclaimed that "Catholic countries" could not tolerate other religions, (no freedom of religion), conscience, separation of church and State condemned, asserted the Pope's temporal authority over all civil rulers (Ratified by Pope Pius IX and Vatican Council) condemned

1870 AD Infallibility of Pope (Vatican council)

1908 AD All Catholics should be christened into the church

1930 AD Public Schools condemned by Pope Pius XII (see 1864 AD)

1950 AD Sinners prayer, invented by Billy Sunday and made popular by Billy Graham. (Some Catholics now use this)

1950 AD Assumption of the body of the Virgin Mary into heaven shortly after her death. (Pope Pius XII)

1954 AD Immaculate conception of Mary proclaimed by Pope Pius XII

1995 AD The use of girls in the traditional alter boy duties

1996 AD Catholics can believe in Evolution (Pope John Paul II)

抽刀斷水

又係唔識野就亂膠翕。

修會神父都會發神貧願。即不會有私人財產。死了没有甚麼東西可留給修會。 ...
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/8 20:14

    發神貧願呢個風俗幾時開始架？睇到啲同你意見相反既見解，分享一下：

Why are Catholic priests required to be celibate when their first pope, Saint Peter, was married?

What’s the answer you will hear today?

That priests are required to be celibate so that they might be fully devoted to the church. This idea is taken from Paul’s view on singleness as a gift from God to be cherished.

It’s a nice idea, but it is also wrong historically.

There are a few major time periods in Church History. The Medieval Ages were some of the darkest periods in the history of the church and one of the primary causes was the ever-growing corruptness of the Roman Catholic church.

In the Medieval Ages, the church sent thousands and thousands of men to fight in the crusades against Islam. Before leaving, the Catholic church convinced many of these men to bequeath their property and possessions to the church.

What was the result? After an estimated 1.7 million people died in the crusades, the Catholic church owned land all over Europe. This land was held by the church and thus, the Priest had ownership of the land.

Now imagine if a Priest had a family. If the Priest were to die, then the children and family would have rights to the property. The church would lose much of its property that it had recently gained.

They had to protect this land somehow.

The easy solution: “Celibacy”

But not true celibacy. Celibacy is the commitment to abstain from sexual behavior with others or one’s self. The true intention was to prevent the priests from having legitimate heirs to their property. Priests were not allowed to marry, but they were allowed to have concubines. As many as they wanted. It was not uncommon at all for the concubine and the children to be involved with the church, to help out, and to live on the grounds.

However, when the priest eventually passed away, none of these children has rights to the property.

Problem Solved.

抽刀斷水

(1) bishop Hosius, to forbid entirely the marriage of priests; but the motion met with strong opposition, and was rejected.(不見有此定案)
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/9 22:43

話到明rejected又點會係定案，奇怪的腦袋。

(2)385 AD In the West, the first prohibition of clerical marriage, which laid claim to universal ecclesiastical authority, proceeded in 385 from the Roman church in the form of a decretal letter of the bishop Siricius to Himerius, bishop of Tarragona in Spain.
最後一個已婚的教宗是Adrian II(792-872)
怎會385年便有禁婚令?!
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/9 22:43

The Directa decretal was written by Pope Siricius in February AD 385. It took the form of a long letter to Spanish bishop Himerius of Tarragona replying to the bishop’s requests for directa on various subjects sent several months earlier to Pope Damasus I. It became the first of a series of documents published by the Magisterium that claimed apostolic origin for clerical celibacy and reminded ministers of the altar of the perpetual continence required of them.

有禁婚令同實行到既時間差異，乃貴教內部矛盾問題。

(3)the church sent thousands and thousands of men to fight in the crusades against Islam. Before leaving, the Catholic church convinced many of these men to bequeath their property and possessions to the church.
(參軍的大部份是貧農, 你講到個個都係地主!)
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/9 22:43

    你既然講得出「參軍的大部份是貧農」，咁講即係有少部分地主啦，即係知道有幾多百分比啦？即係知道財產有幾多啦下話？

抽刀斷水

咁無記錄可尋時，
上邊句咪肯定狗翕？
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/10 00:44

    無定案又唔同無記錄，又一次奇怪的腦袋。教徒面對自己所信奉信仰既歷史，真係會蠢啲？

After the legalization of Christianity in 313, greater discussion regarding clerical celibacy emerged.  At the ecumenical Council of Nicea I (325), Bishop Hosius of Cordoba proposed a decree mandating clerical celibacy, including for those clergy already married.  Egyptian Bishop Paphnutius, unmarried himself, rose in protest, asserting that such a requirement would be too rigorous and imprudent.  Rather, he proposed that those members of the clergy already married should continue to be faithful to their wives, and those who were unmarried should personally decide whether or not to be celibate.

https://catholicstraightanswers. ... riests-be-celibate/

不過我就唔知個minutes係邊個寫，呢個catholicstraightanswers website又係咪可信，聽聞係一位神父創辦。

抽刀斷水

你就講到個個戰死沙場的士兵都有地留俾教會咁:
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/10 02:30

    你知就唔怕講出黎啦，你係咪都係估估吓咋下話？

抽刀斷水

回覆 26# beebeechan


    strong opposition係形容反對既激烈，並唔係形容有幾多人一齊反對，又再一次奇怪的腦袋。

你呢排狀態都好差下，不如休息下先啦。

抽刀斷水

回覆 31# beebeechan


    有好多走盞位既，東正教會同天主教會之間又有東儀天主教會，規距又介乎兩者之間，至於行房日子具體要求、活躍程度、動機等等，我就唔明條腸做咩要畫埋出黎，同埋「口裡說不，身體卻很誠實」，人家有無按規矩做，唔通又要大家過目咩。

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回覆 30# beebeechan


    睇會議結果睇唔到過程，最好搵到份minutes。

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使唔使睇埋CCTV 片段?
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/10 12:34

    對住你呢種包拗頸既人，CCTV、車cam真係好有用。

抽刀斷水

任何規矩都有人唔遵守....
係咪因為咁就唔使定規矩?
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/10 12:41

    睇下最初定規矩既人既原意啦，如果我定呢個規矩「所有網友凡上本網討論區期間不得呼吸」，都預咗無人會遵守啦。

抽刀斷水

謝謝指正，規矩。

管理員可以修改任何文字而不留痕跡，呢個係討論區系統賦予既權力，我即刻改哂你地都奈我唔何，無哂證據。

抽刀斷水

不至於唔准抖氣。
呢啲版規都好大路

無守既人都唔少，包括我。

嗰條無聊下流虫就成日衰（2）（3） ...
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/10 14:46

    理想世界就梗係立法、執法、司法可以好完美咁運行到啦，我為避嫌更加唔應該參與討論添呢，但咁又有邊個肯做？唔通有錢請終審法院法官團幫手咩？

抽刀斷水

當你上到天國, 與那位alpha and omega在一起時，　無時間領域，　可玩「穿越」。。。。
回到尼西亞會議現 ...
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/10 22:20

    唔通呢個就係天國既樂趣？不過當時間延伸到無限長，任何歷史事件都「穿越」哂啦，無哂癮。

抽刀斷水

時間延伸到無限長, 72個都未必夠玩, 到時先睇啦, 唔使咁快諗定嘅
沙文 發表於 2024/1/11 03:36

    畀盡你做痴心情長劍，一生只愛一個，咁一生人大約100歲啦，當時間延伸到無限長，就需要【∞／100】個susanna先夠，所以72個唔係未必夠玩，係一定唔夠玩。

抽刀斷水

獨身令有望解禁 教廷高層：認真考慮開放神父結婚
Newtalk新聞 |洪聖斐 編譯報導
2024年1月8日 週一 上午7:30

身兼梵蒂岡教義辦公室部長的馬耳他大主教查爾斯·希克魯納（Charles Scicluna）7日表示，羅馬天主教會應該「認真考慮」允許神父結婚。

路透社（Reuters）報導，馬耳他大主教查爾斯·希克魯納表示「這可能是我第一次公開這麼說，對某些人來說這聽起來很異端。」大主教說：「經驗告訴我，這是我們需要認真思考的事情。」

希克魯納指出，神父有時也會墜入愛河，然後就必須「在對象和神職之間做出選擇，一些神父秘密地建立情感關係來應對這一問題」。因為婚姻的抉擇，已經讓天主教會失去了許多偉大的神父。

希克魯納指出，一千年前神父被允許結婚，如今在東方禮天主教會（Eastern Catholic Churches）也還是允許神父結婚。「如果由我決定，我會修改神父必須獨身的要求。」

報導指出，羅馬天主教神父是否應該允許結婚的爭論已經存在了幾個世紀，反對神職人員結婚者認為，獨身可以讓神父將自己完全奉獻給教會。

教宗方濟各已經表明不會修改羅馬天主教要求神父必須獨身的規定。 但這不是教會的正式教義，因此未來的教宗可能會改變這項規定。

https://tw.news.yahoo.com/%E7%8D ... 9%9A-233025422.html

抽按：是否正在給予現任神父或未來神父一個假希望？

抽刀斷水

一些神父秘密地建立情感關係來應對這一問題
抽刀斷水 發表於 2024/1/14 12:50

    「獨身」好處是無須婚姻約束趙完即鬆無la無lung，跟現代飲食男女不婚主義相近，白天信徒面前仍保留獨身聖潔形象，晚上夜夜纏綿風流快活隨時換伴，好處是你情我願唔駛影響其他小童。人所共知的「口裡說不身體誠實」，部分資深版友卻接受不到赤裸事實。

抽刀斷水

以今日東方教會的規矩
就是結了婚的人可以當神父,
當了神父的...就不可結婚, 即使之前配偶離世, 亦不可再 ...
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/14 23:02

    咁個語法就唔係話［羅馬天主教會應該「認真考慮」允許神父結婚］，而係［羅馬天主教會應該「認真考慮」允許已婚人士出任神父］。

抽刀斷水

這叫「淫亂」,, 不是獨身, 結婚的問題
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/14 22:17

    「淫亂」是貶義詞，「風流」是褒義詞，所形容的卻都是一樣的事情。

抽刀斷水

這是人, 勝不過身體的肉慾, 正不是原祖墮落的原因嗎?
基督宗教就是叫人不要為肉慾的奴隷。是人支配慾念, ...
beebeechan 發表於 2024/1/14 22:49

    「如果認同人是受造之物，那隨之附送的當然是具備正常功能的性器官，有正常的性功能和性慾。」